I saw it yesterday or the day before it.
Notch is going apeshit on Yogscast, and a lot of people are going apeshit as well :P
Dramaaaaa
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#2
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Posted 23 November 2011 - 06:19 AM
On the one hand Notch did say some shit to Yogscast like jokes about Simon's mom, but I think it was all just a big misunderstanding coupled with Yogscast being assholes.. They don't realize that it's Notch who made them rich and famous and not the other way round.
#3
Posted 23 November 2011 - 07:16 AM
Notch is a still a bitch regardless :P
And I don't know about Yogscast. They made it a joke about payment.
The guy who made the video in the thread (if you took a look) tries to take things out of context to make Yogscast look like bigger assholes.
Yogscast did go over the line I will admit, but they are not THAT much worse than Notch himself. He should get off his own ego horse, and stop being so butthurt =/
He could choose to not care aboure what Yogscast say, and just get on with his career.
And I don't know about Yogscast. They made it a joke about payment.
The guy who made the video in the thread (if you took a look) tries to take things out of context to make Yogscast look like bigger assholes.
Yogscast did go over the line I will admit, but they are not THAT much worse than Notch himself. He should get off his own ego horse, and stop being so butthurt =/
He could choose to not care aboure what Yogscast say, and just get on with his career.
#4
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Posted 23 November 2011 - 07:21 AM
You can't partnership with a company (or group) that slenderises everything your brand stands for - even if it was not meant in that context. The guys did not act professional, and though Notch's reaction was not professional, the result of disowning them is what any business would of needed to have done.
#5
Posted 23 November 2011 - 09:23 AM
No one ever said that Yogscast were professional. They are just nerds having a good time mostly. I mean, think about it. Why did Notch let Yogscast represent Mojang, at that convention, instead of Notch himself? (The one with Sony Ericsson)
That just tells me, that he didn't really care enough to be honest.
That just tells me, that he didn't really care enough to be honest.
#6
Posted 23 November 2011 - 09:48 AM
Yogscast was arrogant. That was apparent in the videos I saw and the things I have read about it. There was British humour to count for the crudeness, but that's not the problem. They were rude to a good number of people and did not have a good attitude while at Minecon. From the conventions I have been to, and comparing them to other youtube "celebrities" they were complete asses and honestly don't deserve to be to another minecon as invited guests. They were being cocky.
I don't care about the F-bombs, because Kids shouldn't be at a god damn convention for a videogame and expect political correctedness. anyway, but that's my opinion.
I don't care about the F-bombs, because Kids shouldn't be at a god damn convention for a videogame and expect political correctedness. anyway, but that's my opinion.
Yay
#7
Posted 23 November 2011 - 10:01 AM
You ever been to the Yogscast forums?
They are just two nerds usually just fucking around :b
That Notch let them represent him at the con with SE, was just a huge misstep from Notch in my honest opinion. He should have been there himself and not let two nerds (Mostly Lewis though) represent him and his firm. I am sure it helped some on the attitude.
And you can ask even Totalbiscuit. He came out and said that Yogscast (mostly joking though) talking about being paid, to go to such an event is normal.
I wouldn't exactly say that Notch's handling of the situation was one bit better.
He took it to the internet, instead of just telling them off or saying that they crossed the line too much in person. Not only that, but he did when he knew they were flying home and unable to respond. That's just fucking unprofessional. Besides, Notch made "funny" jokes about him fucking Simon's Mom. Not exactly wonderful either is it?
[spoiler=Totalbiscuit's Statment]Quote
[–]TotalBiscuit 479 points 1 hour ago*
Looks like the witchhunt on both sides is in full swing, here's my two-pence on the latest developments, point by point.
Yogscast repeatedly insulted people, talked behind their backs, refused to cooperate, and acted like total spoiled divas nonstop.
This really doesn't sound like the Simon and Lewis I know, who are generally extremely chilled out fun people, both online and in real life.
They called us "a bunch of nerds who don't know how to run a company", demanded that we pay them to come here (nobody else got paid).
Alright so, when you bring celebrities to a convention, do you generally ask them to come for free? If you run a Star Trek convention, do you ask Riker and Spock to attend gratis? You expect them to go without compensation, which usually includes transatlantic flights and accomodation for several people as well as an appearance fee? No, you don't. Conventions rely on the celebrities in question to bring people to the event, drive traffic to the stream and add value. Yogscast are not just a couple of random fans, this is their full-time job. I've been doing events for a while now as a commentator, if an event didn't offer to pay for my services I'd have to think twice about going. Why? Because it's my job, doing things for free devalues you and it's very easy to be taken for a ride if you act like a push-over. If it was down the road, sure, maybe. If it's half way across the planet, well yeah, I'd kinda want to get paid for doing that gig, as would pretty much every eSports commentator. Yogscast went to do a panel and sign autographs, that in itself is a service, not to mention the fact that it takes them away from their regular jobs. The fact that no-one else got paid does not indicate a problem with Yogscast, but with a multi-millionaire staffing a convention with volunteers. Having seen some of the footage from Minecon, "a bunch of nerds who don't know how to run a company" is exactly how I'd describe Mojang and y'know what? I wouldn't even say that's a bad thing. The whole grass-roots "hey we're just one guy and his idea who made it big" thing is endearing and honest, but as we've just seen from this rampage, professionalism is not the highest priority of Mojang at the moment and they really don't know how to run a company. That line can be taken in many different ways, particularly coming from 2 British guys that are known to take the piss (like every British guy ever born).
And they claim they're the reason minecraft is big and that we should thank them more than anyone else in the community. They're total dicks
They are certainly the biggest driving force behind Minecraft at present, you only need to look at the view count. After Seananners stopped doing Minecraft content, Yogscast became a massive source of free promotion for the game. Their videos hit the frontpage of Youtube every day, showing Minecraft off on the second largest search engine in the world time after time. I'm not sure Notch fully grasps just how much that many views on Youtube can do for your product. To give another example, the Magicka developers told me that they attribute the majority of their sales to WTF is Magicka and The Yogscast and TotalBiscuit play Magicka. This would make sense, if you look at the views on those videos, they are massive. For an indie company, Youtube and word of mouth are the two biggest forms of free marketing available and guess what generates word of mouth? Well how about literally over a million people watching and talking about Yogscast Minecraft videos? If anything, Notch does actually sound a little ungrateful here which is a rather flabbergasting attitude from an indie dev and one I've never seen before (those who don't know, my main source of income is my WTF is series which hilights indie games, it's fairly well viewed and I've had nothing but gratitude from devs whose games I've promoted). I suppose when you get as big and as wealthy as Notch, the attitude can change.
A kid wanted them to sign something I had signed, and they said they'd cross it out and put "fuck you" there instead.
Welcome to Yogscast humour and more to the point, British humour. The easily offended need not to apply. How old was this kid? The Yogscast demographic is quite young anyway and there is plenty of harsh language in their videos, not to mention they would hear much worse on the playground. This sounds like a joke, not a particularly good one, but a joke none-the-less and not worth getting in a tizzy over.
Everyone else in the Minecraft community is all about respecting and caring. They're not. They're an isolated island of egos.
Well no, it's not Notch, you've bred one of the most retarded fanbases in gaming history. It's not your fault, but the entire Minecraft community is not in fact, about respecting and caring. There are subcommunities within it that are, /r/Minecraft is a great subreddit from what I can see, Yogscast also has a large community of it's own over on it's forums that does just as you describe. However, you also have a lot of immature, raging assholes in your "community" as well as plenty of others who are just out for themselves. Those people don't do massive charity streams like Yogscast do, they don't promote mods (and yes I am aware of the issues with the Yogbox, nobody goes through life without fuckups), they don't act as an extremely important stimulus to the community that you apparently love so much. Yogscast is without question one of the most important forces within not only Minecraft but at this point, gaming in general. They wield a massive amount of influence and they make a hell of a lot of people very happy.
Who knows what actually happened, it will be interesting to see if the community points the pitchforks back at Notch after Yogscast is able to make their statement (they are probably still on a plane right now) and tell their side of the story. Everyone loves a good witch-hunt, but a little perspective here please and do we really have to air this dirty laundry in public?[/spoiler]
They are just two nerds usually just fucking around :b
That Notch let them represent him at the con with SE, was just a huge misstep from Notch in my honest opinion. He should have been there himself and not let two nerds (Mostly Lewis though) represent him and his firm. I am sure it helped some on the attitude.
And you can ask even Totalbiscuit. He came out and said that Yogscast (mostly joking though) talking about being paid, to go to such an event is normal.
I wouldn't exactly say that Notch's handling of the situation was one bit better.
He took it to the internet, instead of just telling them off or saying that they crossed the line too much in person. Not only that, but he did when he knew they were flying home and unable to respond. That's just fucking unprofessional. Besides, Notch made "funny" jokes about him fucking Simon's Mom. Not exactly wonderful either is it?
[spoiler=Totalbiscuit's Statment]Quote
[–]TotalBiscuit 479 points 1 hour ago*
Looks like the witchhunt on both sides is in full swing, here's my two-pence on the latest developments, point by point.
Yogscast repeatedly insulted people, talked behind their backs, refused to cooperate, and acted like total spoiled divas nonstop.
This really doesn't sound like the Simon and Lewis I know, who are generally extremely chilled out fun people, both online and in real life.
They called us "a bunch of nerds who don't know how to run a company", demanded that we pay them to come here (nobody else got paid).
Alright so, when you bring celebrities to a convention, do you generally ask them to come for free? If you run a Star Trek convention, do you ask Riker and Spock to attend gratis? You expect them to go without compensation, which usually includes transatlantic flights and accomodation for several people as well as an appearance fee? No, you don't. Conventions rely on the celebrities in question to bring people to the event, drive traffic to the stream and add value. Yogscast are not just a couple of random fans, this is their full-time job. I've been doing events for a while now as a commentator, if an event didn't offer to pay for my services I'd have to think twice about going. Why? Because it's my job, doing things for free devalues you and it's very easy to be taken for a ride if you act like a push-over. If it was down the road, sure, maybe. If it's half way across the planet, well yeah, I'd kinda want to get paid for doing that gig, as would pretty much every eSports commentator. Yogscast went to do a panel and sign autographs, that in itself is a service, not to mention the fact that it takes them away from their regular jobs. The fact that no-one else got paid does not indicate a problem with Yogscast, but with a multi-millionaire staffing a convention with volunteers. Having seen some of the footage from Minecon, "a bunch of nerds who don't know how to run a company" is exactly how I'd describe Mojang and y'know what? I wouldn't even say that's a bad thing. The whole grass-roots "hey we're just one guy and his idea who made it big" thing is endearing and honest, but as we've just seen from this rampage, professionalism is not the highest priority of Mojang at the moment and they really don't know how to run a company. That line can be taken in many different ways, particularly coming from 2 British guys that are known to take the piss (like every British guy ever born).
And they claim they're the reason minecraft is big and that we should thank them more than anyone else in the community. They're total dicks
They are certainly the biggest driving force behind Minecraft at present, you only need to look at the view count. After Seananners stopped doing Minecraft content, Yogscast became a massive source of free promotion for the game. Their videos hit the frontpage of Youtube every day, showing Minecraft off on the second largest search engine in the world time after time. I'm not sure Notch fully grasps just how much that many views on Youtube can do for your product. To give another example, the Magicka developers told me that they attribute the majority of their sales to WTF is Magicka and The Yogscast and TotalBiscuit play Magicka. This would make sense, if you look at the views on those videos, they are massive. For an indie company, Youtube and word of mouth are the two biggest forms of free marketing available and guess what generates word of mouth? Well how about literally over a million people watching and talking about Yogscast Minecraft videos? If anything, Notch does actually sound a little ungrateful here which is a rather flabbergasting attitude from an indie dev and one I've never seen before (those who don't know, my main source of income is my WTF is series which hilights indie games, it's fairly well viewed and I've had nothing but gratitude from devs whose games I've promoted). I suppose when you get as big and as wealthy as Notch, the attitude can change.
A kid wanted them to sign something I had signed, and they said they'd cross it out and put "fuck you" there instead.
Welcome to Yogscast humour and more to the point, British humour. The easily offended need not to apply. How old was this kid? The Yogscast demographic is quite young anyway and there is plenty of harsh language in their videos, not to mention they would hear much worse on the playground. This sounds like a joke, not a particularly good one, but a joke none-the-less and not worth getting in a tizzy over.
Everyone else in the Minecraft community is all about respecting and caring. They're not. They're an isolated island of egos.
Well no, it's not Notch, you've bred one of the most retarded fanbases in gaming history. It's not your fault, but the entire Minecraft community is not in fact, about respecting and caring. There are subcommunities within it that are, /r/Minecraft is a great subreddit from what I can see, Yogscast also has a large community of it's own over on it's forums that does just as you describe. However, you also have a lot of immature, raging assholes in your "community" as well as plenty of others who are just out for themselves. Those people don't do massive charity streams like Yogscast do, they don't promote mods (and yes I am aware of the issues with the Yogbox, nobody goes through life without fuckups), they don't act as an extremely important stimulus to the community that you apparently love so much. Yogscast is without question one of the most important forces within not only Minecraft but at this point, gaming in general. They wield a massive amount of influence and they make a hell of a lot of people very happy.
Who knows what actually happened, it will be interesting to see if the community points the pitchforks back at Notch after Yogscast is able to make their statement (they are probably still on a plane right now) and tell their side of the story. Everyone loves a good witch-hunt, but a little perspective here please and do we really have to air this dirty laundry in public?[/spoiler]
#8
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Posted 23 November 2011 - 10:37 AM
Lol, I'd not seen Totalbiscuit's response. It's brilliant, even if it is hypocritical.
#9
Posted 23 November 2011 - 10:50 AM
Eh, both Notch and Yogscast are to blame for this situation. Both sides could have handled this much better.
Yay
#10
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Posted 23 November 2011 - 11:04 AM
I haven't really followed this whole charade, but from little I've gathered both Notch and Yogscast are more or less being complete fuckwits. I couldn't think of a better word, so there you go.
Notch, who made a fantastic indie game but only gained publicity when people like Yogscast and Seananners started showing his game off, seems to have no appreciation for what these people are doing for his game and his company. Also, just from the way he's approached this, his professionality seems a bit... lacking.
The Yogscast, on the other hand, are just acting like a bunch of children. They act like they're entitled to something -- which in some cases, I can understand, like the invitation to MineCon example that TotalBiscuit gave -- but in other cases, it just comes across as selfish.
Both sides are at fault here, and neither Notch nor Yogscast can see that the other isn't the only thing creating a problem here. Both aren't cooperating, and both are making this ten times harder than it needs to be. I can understand how both sides could be offended by the others' actions, but this is becoming more comparable to a children's fight than a fight between adults.
Notch, who made a fantastic indie game but only gained publicity when people like Yogscast and Seananners started showing his game off, seems to have no appreciation for what these people are doing for his game and his company. Also, just from the way he's approached this, his professionality seems a bit... lacking.
The Yogscast, on the other hand, are just acting like a bunch of children. They act like they're entitled to something -- which in some cases, I can understand, like the invitation to MineCon example that TotalBiscuit gave -- but in other cases, it just comes across as selfish.
Both sides are at fault here, and neither Notch nor Yogscast can see that the other isn't the only thing creating a problem here. Both aren't cooperating, and both are making this ten times harder than it needs to be. I can understand how both sides could be offended by the others' actions, but this is becoming more comparable to a children's fight than a fight between adults.
#11
Posted 23 November 2011 - 03:11 PM
You are typing, as if the Yogscast even fought back.
Which they didn't. Notch just made his tweets when he knew they were on the plane home to the UK. A situation, where they have NO way of answering whatsoever. It's depressing.
Which they didn't. Notch just made his tweets when he knew they were on the plane home to the UK. A situation, where they have NO way of answering whatsoever. It's depressing.
#12
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Posted 23 November 2011 - 05:21 PM
Either way, I can't see this going well for either side. And it's really ballsed up the reputation of both sides, namely Notch's, who's beloved (and, may I say, slightly big-headed move) MineCon.
Regardless of the result, both sides will be rather sheepish after and the public probably won't really care of who was at fault.
Regardless of the result, both sides will be rather sheepish after and the public probably won't really care of who was at fault.
#13
Posted 23 November 2011 - 05:52 PM
Both of them (Yogscast and Notch) are assholes, neither of them deserve to be at the "level of fame" they are at right now. Notch is the last person that deserves a game of Minecraft's level, and Yogscast is just two British guys who somehow "made it big".
But in terms of this (stupidass) fight, I side with Yogscast "officially". Sure, one of them said "fuck" but really, I don't know anybody who doesn't say fuck, even at a young age (My friends bro is 8 and told him to "Shut the fuck up" yesterday on Skype). What Notch said to Yogscast and his mother and masturbation is way worse.
I'm really just disgusted by this entire fight. Stupid people fighting over stupid things caused by stupid decisions by stupid people.
But in terms of this (stupidass) fight, I side with Yogscast "officially". Sure, one of them said "fuck" but really, I don't know anybody who doesn't say fuck, even at a young age (My friends bro is 8 and told him to "Shut the fuck up" yesterday on Skype). What Notch said to Yogscast and his mother and masturbation is way worse.
I'm really just disgusted by this entire fight. Stupid people fighting over stupid things caused by stupid decisions by stupid people.
The Great and Powerful Trixie, bitches.
#14
Posted 23 November 2011 - 06:02 PM
#15
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Posted 23 November 2011 - 06:11 PM
That statement is so stupid... I dunno.... it just reaks "kiss-ass the community so we don't look like dicks."
I think they're both dickish. I've always thought notch was dickish, but now I think Yoggscast is very dickish too.
I think they're both dickish. I've always thought notch was dickish, but now I think Yoggscast is very dickish too.
#16
Posted 23 November 2011 - 06:17 PM
You do realize how many people actually came for MineCon to meet Yogscast and NOT to meet Notch, and his team, right?
Besides, it IS because of the community that Simon and Lewis are what they are today...
So saying thanks to them, and being humble to them, is pretty fucking smart if you ask me.
What would you have done?
They are telling their side of the story, and at least they are not going about this immaturely like a certain someone *cough* NOTCH *cough*.
Did you read Totalbiscuits statement by the way? About paying celebs to attend your Con? You should if you haven't.
Besides, it IS because of the community that Simon and Lewis are what they are today...
So saying thanks to them, and being humble to them, is pretty fucking smart if you ask me.
What would you have done?
They are telling their side of the story, and at least they are not going about this immaturely like a certain someone *cough* NOTCH *cough*.
Did you read Totalbiscuits statement by the way? About paying celebs to attend your Con? You should if you haven't.
#17
Posted 23 November 2011 - 06:38 PM
Well it's either Notch is completely bullshitting the entire thing (Which I wouldn't put it past him), or Yogscast is a bunch of idiots who are denying everything because they are afraid they will lose a huge chunk of their fanbase through this (Which a lot of those dumbass Notchtards are saying they will are never watching Yogscast again).
And from Yogscast's response, it seems it's Notch making shit up, because all of their responses have support to back it up, while Notch is making 140-character accusations with no support.
And from Yogscast's response, it seems it's Notch making shit up, because all of their responses have support to back it up, while Notch is making 140-character accusations with no support.
The Great and Powerful Trixie, bitches.
#18
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Posted 23 November 2011 - 06:57 PM
Also, I see Simon and Lewis as far more reputable than Notch, purely because of the fact ye olde Yogscast have helped players in WoW et al before Minecraft even got involved.
#19
Posted 23 November 2011 - 07:10 PM
Fuck em both.
Look down, look down, you'll always be a slave..
Look down, look down, you're standing in your grave...
Look down, look down, you're standing in your grave...
#20
Posted 23 November 2011 - 07:49 PM
Regardless of what really happened, Notch seriously needs to learn to shut his fucking mouth. Like with the lawsuit shit, he just needs to stop publicly saying this crap. All it does is cause unnecessary problems and make him look like a complete asshole (which he definitely is). He still hasn't learned that, because of his popularity, what he says has a big impact. It has come back to bite him in the ass over and over, but he still does it.
Albert Einstein once said that the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, expecting different results. Notch is the rat in the lab that keeps pushing the red button and getting electrocuted, instead of trying the green one and getting fed.
Albert Einstein once said that the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, expecting different results. Notch is the rat in the lab that keeps pushing the red button and getting electrocuted, instead of trying the green one and getting fed.
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